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BlackBox midi slave behaviour (pads don't stop?)

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  • BlackBox midi slave behaviour (pads don't stop?)

    I have a midi controller (a keystep pro) connected to the BlackBox via the TRS midi in.

    The transport controls on the KSP seem to control the BlackBox correctly, when I click play the blackbox starts playing armed clips etc etc, but when I press stop, if I'm playing sequences on the blackbox, those do stop at the next quantisation point, but if I have pads looping, these do not stop when a MIDI stop message is received. I know the blackbox gets the stop message, because the clock at the upper left corner stops.

    How should I have it configured so that looping pads stop and start in response to MIDI transport messages?

  • #2
    Also I noticed on the latest updates that even if a pad is set in gate mode the playback go till the end beyond the end point.
    Anyone can confirm this?

    Comment


    • #3
      This is intended behavior. Sending a STOP command only stops the internal clock. If you want to stop everything from playing on the blackbox, hit the STOP button twice.

      In terms of setting a pad to Gate - make sure to also set the ADSR appropriately. It is possible to stop a clip - and it continues to play another loop iteration depending on the ADSR settings.

      Comment


      • #4
        I personally dislike that this is the intended action. All other gear I own starts and stops with whatever I use as my master, which is rarely the BlackBox. I would like to see a menu item to towel this behavior so that both choices are available.
        Having said that, I have also learned to incorporate the behavior into my songs, using the BB as a glorified mute group that keeps playing when I stop the other gear.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Steve View Post
          This is intended behavior. Sending a STOP command only stops the internal clock. If you want to stop everything from playing on the blackbox, hit the STOP button twice.

          In terms of setting a pad to Gate - make sure to also set the ADSR appropriately. It is possible to stop a clip - and it continues to play another loop iteration depending on the ADSR settings.
          Tried everything in particular the adsr but the stop(I mean the blue line) is not respected as on previous versions.The sample start perfectly works.I put the line where I want on the sample and that start playing just from there but not the stop it goes till the end of the sample.

          Comment


          • Steve
            Steve commented
            Editing a comment
            Can you share a video or a preset? I'd like to make sure I understand exactly what you are seeing on your end.

        • #6
          Originally posted by alemass View Post

          Tried everything in particular the adsr but the stop(I mean the blue line) is not respected as on previous versions.The sample start perfectly works.I put the line where I want on the sample and that start playing just from there but not the stop it goes till the end of the sample.
          I'm mastering the full album and I've no time these days but as soon as I finish for sure Steve.I'm quote sure that's a bug introduced with latests updates before the gate function was working perfectly.

          Comment


          • #7
            Originally posted by Steve View Post
            This is intended behavior. Sending a STOP command only stops the internal clock. If you want to stop everything from playing on the blackbox, hit the STOP button twice.

            In terms of setting a pad to Gate - make sure to also set the ADSR appropriately. It is possible to stop a clip - and it continues to play another loop iteration depending on the ADSR settings.
            Thanks. Just to confirm, when you say "if you want to stop everything from playing on the blackbox, hit the stop button twice", are you saying that two MIDI stop messages from my MIDI master device should stop everything on the blackbox immediately? If so, that's not the behaviour I'm seeing.

            On the other hand, maybe by "hit the stop button twice" you're referring to the physical stop button on the blackbox itself? If so, then the MIDI implementation is broken - why would it be intended behaviour to have a MIDI slave that doesn't respond to STOP commands?

            Comment


            • #8
              The physical button. MIDI implementation is not broken. MIDI Stop stops the internal clock. There is no explicit setting to force the blackbox into follower mode for sync. When it receives sync, it follows it. When sync is no longer present, the blackbox takes over.

              Comment


              • #9
                I'm not quite sure what you mean by "follower mode", since that isn't something defined anywhere that I'm aware of in the MIDI standards.

                The MIDI Association do say at https://www.midi.org/midi-articles/a...-midi-messages however:

                "The System Real Time messages are the Timing Clock, Start, Continue, Stop, Active Sensing, and the System Reset message. The Timing Clock message is the master clock which sets the tempo for playback of a sequence. The Timing Clock message is sent 24 times per quarter note."

                As you said, when the blackbox receives 24ppqn MIDI sync it follows that tempo. The fact it can take over with internal clock when there isn't an external clock doesn't mean it should willfully ignore an explicit stop message!

                A stop message, and the simple absence of an external clock, are not the same thing.

                The MIDI Association page goes on to say that "The Start, Continue, and Stop messages are used to control playback of the sequence."

                So I guess if you want to call the "sequence" strictly the SEQ page on the blackbox then the current behaviour is in accordance with those words, but surely not the spirit of them, since I'm unaware of any reason anybody would actively _want_ a MIDI stop message not to stop playback of loops and other ongoing sounds on a slave, whether or not it calls them a "Sequence" (deserving to be stopped) or some other thing, functionally equivalent to a sequence (ie a loop or bunch of loops), then obtusely doesn't stop them!

                I mean if anyone really does want that, it's already proven possible by the current implementation, so could be left as an option.

                Sorry to break it to you, but this is a broken implementation. It's not like I'm the only one to have noticed it and called it broken now that I've searched further and found other threads.

                Please can we get it fixed?

                Comment


                • Steve
                  Steve commented
                  Editing a comment
                  I’m not going to argue this. It functions the way it was intended to function. If you want something different please post to the wish list thread after searching for others post. +1 before posting. Thanks for your Input.

              • #10
                I love the way it works when slaved at the moment.If I want an abrupt stop I always can hit stop on the BB itself. If I could make any change at all, it'd be that the first time I hit stop the release phases of all envelopes would be activated and only if I hit it a second time would you get the abrupt ending. I'd also love, as I've said before, some visual cue about pads in their release phases. I use long releases and a lot of guesswork as to whether my fingers have been noticed...

                Comment


                • #11
                  Hi folks, is there a beginners guide to using the Blackbox as a slave? I want to link it to an RC-505, but I’m too much of a novice to understand the advice I’ve been given.

                  Comment


                  • #12
                    How do you want the blackbox to function? Do you mean you want to start and stop from an external clock? or trigger pads/seqs?

                    Comment


                    • #13
                      Originally posted by Steve View Post
                      How do you want the blackbox to function? Do you mean you want to start and stop from an external clock? or trigger pads/seqs?
                      I've not the same issue as the others:The midi sync works as expected with the squarp pyramid.My issue is just that somethimes the gate function during the playback doesnt work as before the latest updates.But I will investigate further asap and also make a video as you suggested Steve.

                      Comment


                      • #14
                        Originally posted by Steve View Post
                        How do you want the blackbox to function? Do you mean you want to start and stop from an external clock? or trigger pads/seqs?
                        Thanks for responding Steve

                        I’m not exactly sure what it’s capable of, but fundamentally, I just want the tempo in the Blackbox to follow whatever the RC-505 has. And yes, it would be good if starting a loop recording on the RC also triggered the Blackbox to play a sequence or pad (I think once I managed to do this, but now can’t replicate it).

                        However, sometimes it would be good if it DIDN’T happen. Are both options possible?

                        Comment


                        • #15
                          One thing to know is the blackbox does not currently allow for transport control via external MIDI (highly requested). You can, however, start and stop any of the pads using MIDI note #s. The blackbox will accurately follow sync from 40-250 bpm. Including decimal values. The on-screen BPM does not change. You can confirm this by sending MIDI sync to the blackbox, then change the tempo on the RC. Enable the metronome on the blackbox to hear it follow the incoming sync.

                          If you are looking for more MIDI info check this video: https://youtu.be/ZAOaQvMR5uM

                          If you want blackbox videos to get you started (in general) check this playlist: https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PL...L_BrN7tqwjBrwC

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