Toolbox 2.1 feedback

[Aaron]

Start by checking out the new firmware, version 2.1. Please post your impressions below.

Since there have been lots of questions about the future of toolbox firmware, let me try and address that up front:

Our goal is to refine version 2.1 to the point where it will last for a long time. We really want to hear about any bugs you encounter. We plan to revisit this firmware on January 11th based on your feedback. Assuming there are some bugs worth addressing, we will do an update and call that the official version. Please report any problems you encounter over the holidays so that we can take care of them all at the same time.

Thank you very much for your time and feedback.

[alterbreak]

Thanks Aaron! Installed and really excited to use the new features. Will keep track of any issues should they arise and report back. Thanks again to you and your team for the great instruments.

[Filterfreak]

Well i feel humbled and gratitude to you for sorting this out , im in the middle of testing what to me was the most important function ,the midi omni mode so everything else is a big bonus , so again i'll apologise for my rude, needy behavior , i should of had more the faith in you to do what you said you was going to do , and you have gone beyond that , i have no problem with admitting i was wrong and im glad i was because this Toolbox is a now how it should be .....a great bit of kit , i can't see myself using 256 step i use the max of 4 (joke ) .. anyway once again thanks for this update it is well received and a game changer in my work flow . Happy Saturday to you and Missus 1010 ;-)

[Steve]

Thank you. We are a small team. I know it can be frustrating from the outside when you are not getting what you need - or want. I am a user of our gear and totally get it.

That said, I agree with you on this new update. It seems to have breathed new life into this module. And I liked it before! The addition of probability and a smaller grid makes me really happy as an end user.

[Filterfreak]

Ok , i haven't played with all the new functions but the one major one in my setup was the omni mode and it is working perfectly and all the other functions seem to be working without an issue . Once again thank you , my little creation corner is nearly complete , just space for a little more growth . Cheers

[Afturmath]

EDIT: Answered some of my own questions by recording ENV into CREC and analyzing the samples in audacity.

The ENV cell shows a percentage (%) value for each of the ADSR controls. Will you publish the time ranges?
Sample AD values below showing approximate times on the top axis. These were recorded via ENV cell to CV IN to CREC and imported into Audacity (high contrast theme). Right-click -> Open image in new tab to see the time scale more clearly.


Retrigger behavior is restart:

Few feature requests for ENV:

1. Can ADR controls be updated to show times in ms instead of %?
2. Can an output level control be added?
3. Could a control be added to switch retrig behavior?
4. Can an invert toggle be added? Possibly a link to the OUT (or similar) cell for a simultaneous inverted out?
5. MIDI CC control over ADSR, level, invert, and trig/gate source values?
6. Could a curve control be added to smoothly adjust between logarithmic, linear, and exponential slope? (possibly two for attack vs decay/release curves)

[Filterfreak]

Well , loving the fact you can now turn off or select midi channels but i'm having major problems midi syncing . Start/stop works brilliantly , just what i need via midi but the midi on the Toolbox doesn't seem to be following the midi clock from Cubase so no auto tempo adjustments with automation BUT that said it's not a show stopped . the work around is to do this manually per project or record the audio files and use them in musical mode in Cubase .
Maybe ive missed something but i have tried all sorts of configurations in the Cubase midi clock setup and nothing makes any difference

[Aaron]

Our MIDI sync engine is meant to track a steady tempo. Once the tempo changes, you can expect some amount of drift until the tempo locks in a few seconds later. This approach is meant for syncing audio tracks which need a steady time base to play properly. Of course, toolbox is a different product with different needs. Please let us know if a steady tempo isn't working reliably for you.

[Filterfreak]

Ok Aaron , thanks for the reply ,it's no biggy to me , the important thing (for a first world issue ) was the midi omni mode , it seems to be stable tempo tracking once triggered but even if you adjust just the tempo in the DAW it does't catch up and regains sync , ive been adjust the tempo manually , it's not an issue to me , im just point this out .
Maybe someone else could confirm this .

Thanks for these new functions btw

[Steve]

Which MIDI interface? I'm sending MIDI clock from Logic, through an ESI interface to the toolbox. The only time I experience issues is when I 'play' directly after 'stopping'. The toolbox needs 2-3 seconds to properly acknowledge the new sync. How much drift are you experiencing?

[Filterfreak]

Im using Motu 128's , if the tempo on the Toolbox is set to 146 and the tempo in Cubase is 156 it doesn't seem to catch up , even resetting the clock start makes not difference , i will check it out some more tomorrow , im sure i have the "clock follow project tempo " box ticked , but i will check , if you say it's working with logic then it could be user error this end ,Plus no one else has confirmed an issue .

[Steve]

I have a feeling it is your clock settings in Cubase. Logic and Live both sync as expected for me.

[Afturmath]

Additional feature requests:

1. Internal routing of cells 5-8 as gate sources
2. Variable-length gates for the GATE cell like NOTE, using encoders to change individual step length

My goal is to use internally-generated/sequenced gates of varying length ("tied" gates) to trigger ENV without having to eat CV MOD inputs.

[Nocturnes]

number 2 variable length i wanted also for long would be nice to implement that as well!

[909state]

instant muting haven't changed.




It's meaningless.

I'm so disappointed.




please get rid of white frames!!

[Aaron]

Sorry to disappoint. We considered changing the behavior of the white frames. However, they are needed for song mode and sequence automation. The mutes serve a different purpose.

[909state]

I think most users are disappointed with that decision. It's not too late now. Please think again. The white frame is the biggest flaw in toolbox 2.x.

[Filterfreak]

It is annoying i agree ,the amount of times you go to click on the pad then info ,come out of the info as you have deactivated to pad , reactivate and ........ not good for live

[withapillow]

instant muting haven't changed.




It's meaningless.

I'm so disappointed.




please get rid of white frames!!

I just checked and unfortunately have to confirm that this behavior is still in place as if you have not acknowledged the most prominent complain on the first 2.0 firmware.

This is by far the most requested thing for all toolbox users - it is essential to be able to navigate with the touchable grid directly into all cells without muting. Using the knobs and buttons for selection is a tedious procedure with far too many intermediate steps but the only way to navigate without muting with the recent firmware. This change destroys the immediacy and joy of the toolbox and was the ONLY reason I have had to switch back to pre 2.x firmware even though I liked all other new features very much. Please listen to your customers otherwise this update will be a farce.

Aaron Since you mentioned that the white boxes are needed. One thing which would work for me is to replace the "old" mute screen with the new white box "instant mute" mode since it is achieving a similar result but in different ways. Don't get me wrong here, the white box screen is actually quite nice as a more advanced "mute" being a quantized play/stop. But please, please please.. don't take away the fundamental and very valuable immediate grid navigation on the home screen which we are all heavily relying on for productive usage of the toolbox.

[Freequenz]

Hey that's great news, I'll try out the update asap.
I'm so happy to see some progress after a long time here I wish u all happy holidays and a blasigt new year!

[GeraldFitz]

Wow. I can't begin to tell you how happy I am with the 2.1 firmware update. Thank you so much for listening to a lot of our requests and implementing them within the update. I haven't dove too deep into the new features, but I'm already extremely happy.

Daniel

[GeraldFitz]

So I spent the entire day playing around with 2.1, and I feel if a couple of these features are added to the final 2.1 release, then this module will be the ultimate "brain" for the modular environment.

1. "Layers" option for the SEQ/LFO's. I use the SEQ exclusively as a way to quickly draw CV notes that I can send to the V/OCT input on my oscillators. I find it much faster/easier to write notes in the SEQ than the NOTE cells, so having the ability to add layers to the SEQ's would be extremely powerful/helpful.

2. Ability to modulate the Attack, Sustain, Decay, and Release in the envelopes with external CV mod in, or internal LFO's etc. I feel that additional flexibility would add a ton of life into the envelopes.

3. Ability to modulate the LFO waveforms. If we can modulate the depth and rate, then being able to modulate the waveform type would be really fun. Again, just another addition that would give variety when programming "exotic" modulators.

4. REC delay which would really help with performance. Basically have a predetermined "count in" which gives you a second to adjust before making any program changes.

5. Alternative "loop position" feature. Instead of having the blue bar, maybe add a grid which is split into divisions which better reflects the loop position within the song layer. Could possibly be a good addition to the measure counter on the top bar.

6. LFO shape modulations. Now this may be a bit of a stretch, but I thought I'd throw it out there just in case some people like a bit more flexibility with the LFO shapes. Adding a secondary menu by clicking the "info" button opens 4 additional wave shape parameters, i.e. delay, skew, amplitude bend, etc. I feel if this were added to the toolbox, then this would make the module a must have in the modular environment. I found myself wanting to get a zadar for this exact reason, due to the ability to really "dial in" the modulation wave shape.

I find myself doing a ton of sound design with toolbox as my central modulator, so having these features would really add more depth and variety when programming groovy patches.

Daniel

[luxgundel]

Can you confirm, that there is still midi through, but no cv playthrough from midi in ?